Shannon Hale on nontraditional gender roles in children's literature 

• Jenn Florence

In April, Utah author Shannon Hale—who co-writes the Princess in Black illustrated book series with her husband, Dean—responded on Twitter to 1-star Amazon reviews of the latest installment, The Princess in Black and The Prince in Pink. The subject at hand was people responding negatively to a boy character expressing traditionally feminine characteristics. Shannon Hale spoke with City Weekly about the subject, and the bigger issue of people responding negatively to books for children and youth that have subject matter deemed too progressive.

City Weekly: In terms of the books in the series before this one, what has been the ratio of negative to positive response?
Shannon Hale: Ninety-nine percent positive. I don't really hear anything negative.

CW: So does it feel like the character of a boy with more traditionally feminine qualities is pushing more buttons than the character of a girl with more traditionally masculine qualities.
SH: Yes. ... From the beginning, 10 or 11 years ago, we never had anybody say, "You've degraded this girl by putting her in shorts and a mask and having her fight monsters; that's what boys do." We've only had praise. But when we have a boy that does something aside from stereotypical gender expression, it's a problem. ... If you look at Amazon, and you look at the Princess in Black books, they're 5 stars across the board. And then you look at The Prince in Pink, 67 ratings so far, 28 percent are 1 star. "Transgenderism in a book for kindergarteners," "Pushing an agenda on our kids" ... these are just the titles of the reviews. And it's the same thing the series has been about for nine books.

CW: This is obviously part of a bigger conversation regarding adults trying to police the content of books for children and youth. How has this climate affected writers and publishers for any books with a more progressive sensibility?
SH: I told our illustrator [LeUyen Pham], "This is the book that's going to get this series banned." I knew. But I wasn't trying to be controversial; I did it because kids have been asking for it. It's one of the most common questions I'd get: "Will there be a Prince in Pink?" We didn't do it as an "agenda," but because it felt like a natural storyline in this universe. The publisher has been very supportive, but they knew, too.

CW: Where do you think Utah in particular is regarding where we're headed in terms of objections over books for children and youth?
SH: We're one of the more serious cases, for sure. We're one of the states that has specifically passed a law about this [H.B. 374 in 2022]. It may be that we don't hear as much about it, because it's done more quietly. There's more-obvious book-banning, like what's happened in the Alpine School District. What's much more common is quiet banning; teachers and librarians are understandably afraid that they can be held liable, because the law is so vague, so they quietly remove them.

CW: You responded to a negative Amazon reviewer with sympathy and almost sadness for the worldview that produced it. Do you also think on a pragmatic level that's a better way to deal with those who hold such black-and-white views of gender roles?
SH: I was raised in the LDS faith, in a very conservative state, and conservative people are my family, my friends, my foundation. They're not my enemy. I don't believe in us-and-them mentality, at all. But I also know it's so hard, in all aspects. If we can't truly have compassion for ourselves, and our own mistakes and our own shadow selves, we can't have compassion for others. ... I understand the reaction of, "These people are literally trying to kill my children." It is life and death, and it feels scary. But I have a very end-goal mentality. That's why I've been such a prolific writer. So, what do I want to have? A world of love and unity where we all respect each other. And what's the best way to have a society of love and compassion? You've got to be loving and compassionate.

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• Candlewick Publishing

CW: So where do we go from here? What feels like the best path forward for creating an atmosphere where books about and for kids of all kinds aren't perceived as a threat?
SH: There are experts smarter than me who have really actionable plans. ... I don't love making myself a target; I don't love being an activist. I'm really a hermit. But like with that Twitter thread, I sometimes feel like there's something I have to say, and that it might spark curiosity in other people. ... I guess I'm past the age where this wounds me personally. I'm worried about those kids out there, ashamed of being who they really are. I hope things change for their sake.